All times are UTC + 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 23rd, '11, 10:21 
Offline
Xtreme Contributor
Xtreme Contributor

Joined: Mar 5th, '11, 10:32
Posts: 113
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yea
Location: Texas
Hi,

I am doing a science fair project for FFA on aquapoincs. The first plan was to do it on chicken development but the skunks killed all the hens and pullets, so I thought why not AP?? Besides I think I can go much more in depth in AP growing rather than just talking about how a bird grows lol.

I was wondering how one would do this? I have already created my thesis, and created a control group ( soil group) as well as the plants growing in ap. The only issue I have is my system is not even a month old so my data may be false, but I still have 2 months to do this. The greens seem to be doing better in ap, but the fruiting plants ( tomatoes, squash, cucumbers) are about the same as the conrol group. The tomatoes are not growing at all in the grow beds. My ammonia is still high as well as ph, I hope I can get these 2 down inorder to get afew weeks of good growth.

also for those with flood and drain, what dose your flood schedule look like as far as how often and for how long the beds are flooded? Right now mine rests for 1 hour, floods for 30 mins, then rests for another hour, then floods agian. That is my daily pattern.


Top
 Profile  
 
    Advertisement
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 23rd, '11, 11:50 
Offline
Almost divorced
Almost divorced

Joined: May 28th, '10, 07:02
Posts: 1389
Gender: Male
Are you human?: YES
Location: Syd
There is no way to compare the 2 right now. Probably wait till your system is cycled then do it.

_________________
http://www.fishyplants.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 23rd, '11, 21:53 
Offline

Joined: Mar 21st, '11, 00:28
Posts: 4
Gender: Male
Are you human?: YES
Location: United States, Colorado
I saw your post and pondered some responses. First off, I think you need to consider this project for the long haul. I don't know what year you are in school, but AP seems like a good basis for a 2 or 3 year study. Second, I wonder if there is a way to measure the total nitrogen and the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates in both the control and the AP system. That might be an interesting comparison, particularly over time. Third, a measurement of the total biomass of each system might be a great comparison. Just some thoughts.

Good luck. I am an ag teacher so I will follow this with great interest.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 23rd, '11, 22:35 
Offline
Legend Member
Legend Member
User avatar

Joined: Jul 20th, '08, 19:03
Posts: 651
Gender: None specified
Are you human?: What time is it?
Location: Australia nsw
If you still have a couple of months to go, you should see a marked difference by then even after that short a time I would think. Tomatos are heavy feeders, so usually do best in a more mature system as your bio-load increases. What are your Nitrate levels at ATM?

If your using F&D, you can flood your beds as soon as they've drained if you want to. Most people use the general guideline of 15/45. Whats your fish to GB ratio sitting at?

BTW, dont worry too much about your Ph, but stop feeding until your Amm levels drop... let your bacteria develop enough to convert... also remember that the bacteria that converts the nitrites takes longer to grow than the first one.

Once your cycled and your nutrients start building up you will be surprised how much your plants will jump... keep in mind tho too that sometimes your initial plants put into an uncycled system may end up stunted so perhaps stagger your plantings a little if possible... if you have 3 months of system running time, maybe 3 plantings - one each month (so the last has 1 month to grow)... might be worth documenting each plantings growth rate 1 month after planting as the system matures to see if this is the case...?

_________________
Why try to explain miracles to your kids when you can just have them plant a garden.


Our System:
viewtopic.php?t=8016


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 23rd, '11, 22:41 
Offline
Legend Member
Legend Member
User avatar

Joined: Jul 20th, '08, 19:03
Posts: 651
Gender: None specified
Are you human?: What time is it?
Location: Australia nsw
Country dirt has a point too... if your looking at it for the long haul, and not sure if this helps either, but have read somewhere that the first year in AP your production is slightly less than Hydro, 2nd year is equal to... and 3rd year blows it out of the water! So as you can see, it CAN take a while for a system to mature to the point of 'unbelievable' growth, but even then I think you will be happy with your results after 3 months... keep us posted please :D

_________________
Why try to explain miracles to your kids when you can just have them plant a garden.


Our System:
viewtopic.php?t=8016


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 23rd, '11, 23:45 
Offline
Xtreme Contributor
Xtreme Contributor

Joined: Mar 5th, '11, 10:32
Posts: 113
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yea
Location: Texas
Last time i checked, my nitrates were 0. Before that they were 1 ( i think) . I havent fed in a while and I am not sure I understand what you mean by fish to grow bed ratio?? I have about 14 gold fish, and 30 minnows in 200 gallons. The grow beds are about 30 gallons total. I know that may not be sufficent but I am doing water changes to make up for the toxic build up. I am thinking about adding more grow beds too. I heard the volume of grow bed should equal the tanks?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 24th, '11, 06:14 
Offline
Almost divorced
Almost divorced

Joined: May 28th, '10, 07:02
Posts: 1389
Gender: Male
Are you human?: YES
Location: Syd
theguy67 wrote:
Last time i checked, my nitrates were 0. Before that they were 1 ( i think) . I havent fed in a while and I am not sure I understand what you mean by fish to grow bed ratio?? I have about 14 gold fish, and 30 minnows in 200 gallons. The grow beds are about 30 gallons total. I know that may not be sufficent but I am doing water changes to make up for the toxic build up. I am thinking about adding more grow beds too. I heard the volume of grow bed should equal the tanks?


The grow bed to fish ratio determines how much filtration you have thus giving you a max amount of fish you can have in there before you get into trouble.

If you are doing constant water changes your system will take longer to cycle (might cause issues with the bacteria count too) and it might not show the growth like in a normal AP system.

_________________
http://www.fishyplants.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 24th, '11, 21:47 
Offline
Legend Member
Legend Member
User avatar

Joined: Jul 20th, '08, 19:03
Posts: 651
Gender: None specified
Are you human?: What time is it?
Location: Australia nsw
theguy67 wrote:
Last time i checked, my nitrates were 0. Before that they were 1 ( i think) . I havent fed in a while and I am not sure I understand what you mean by fish to grow bed ratio?? I have about 14 gold fish, and 30 minnows in 200 gallons. The grow beds are about 30 gallons total. I know that may not be sufficent but I am doing water changes to make up for the toxic build up. I am thinking about adding more grow beds too. I heard the volume of grow bed should equal the tanks?


Firstly, how high is your Ammonia?

If you can give us some more specific info on your test results (and results youve had so far if they have showed any movement up or down) it will help to see whats happening and how close you are to cycling....

If you havent cycled yet you wouldnt have much of a nitrate reading anyway... remember, you are waiting for the first bacteria to colonise to the point that it is converting your Amm to nitrites, so as your Amm drops down you should get a nitrite spike... once the nitrites are dropping as they are converting over to nitrates, you should then have a definite nitrate reading (ours has been sitting at 20 ppm for a while now but some people dont see much of a reading after cycling as their system is so well balanced with plant growth that it is using all the nitrates that are produced... so this can be deceptive sometimes when its at 0)

I would add more GBs... once your Amm drops and you can start feeding flat out, you will definitely need more filtration than you have ATM. :?

Hope some of this makes sense... been a long day...to be continued 2moro... wen brain... is... ... werkin... :sleepy2:

_________________
Why try to explain miracles to your kids when you can just have them plant a garden.


Our System:
viewtopic.php?t=8016


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 25th, '11, 06:07 
Offline
Xtreme Contributor
Xtreme Contributor

Joined: Mar 5th, '11, 10:32
Posts: 113
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yea
Location: Texas
My ammonia was at 4 last time i checked. I know thats high, but we will see. I have not had many more deaths as far as fish once I added the salt. I could add more grow beds right now acctually ( like today!!) but the 2nd pump stoped working without having to be kick started,..in other words it will not turn on by itself with out assistance, so unless I want constant flow ( which I just convereted from) I will need to fix the pump. If anyone has ideas on that it would really help. I am not sure on the specs of the pump or the type, i have had it for years.

As far as the project, should I continue to collect data? or should I wait a month or so? When I created my hypothesis, i made a description page of the project and in part of it it was explaining the slow increase of growth on Group A ( aquaponics). I dont really have my B group yet ( soil) but I may start them either this weekend or next month and when I do I will add more plants to the A group.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 25th, '11, 06:31 
Offline
Xtreme Contributor
Xtreme Contributor

Joined: Mar 5th, '11, 10:32
Posts: 113
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yea
Location: Texas
also just a quick question. Would it be pointless, or less efficeint to drain water from one grow bed into another to save on pumping? I would assume the 2nd bed would only be getting "cleaner" water which would deffinately not help But if the plants were greens I do not see why not? but agian i am not sure how clean the water would be.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 25th, '11, 08:46 
Offline
Legend Member
Legend Member
User avatar

Joined: Jul 20th, '08, 19:03
Posts: 651
Gender: None specified
Are you human?: What time is it?
Location: Australia nsw
When you are trying to cycle your system, you really need to be testing every day if possible as it can happen really quickly. So whether you are using your data collected for your science project or not, I think you should still do your tests. I did daily readings and logged them... sometimes morning and night to be honest when we were on the edge... but they were logged separately - you should test around the same time each day as morning tests will be different from arvo ones.

The problem is that if your Amm was 4 last time you checked... and if that was a week or two ago and your fish are fine, you could have already cycled, everything is fine, and your fish are fasting for no reason...... or you havent.... How do you know?

If you can, do a full test today... do you have a test kit that does Nitrites and Nitrates? Havent mentioned Ni so wasnt sure. Test and post your results for us... Ph, Amm, Ni, Na, and Temp would be the perfect post :)

As to your last post... put the GBs in. As you said you can always put the heavier feeders in the first one and greens in the second, but to be honest, ATM you probably just need more beds...

And dont do water changes unless you have to - have you only been doing them when your testing high readings?... if youve been doing them flat out the last few weeks regardless, it may be part of the prob.... or its the only thing keeping the fish alive :think:

You need to make sure your system is working properly or your next 3 months are going to be a high maintainance pain instead of a pleasure...

just IMO, Cheers.

PS: .... ttteeeeessssttt................... :wink: ......

_________________
Why try to explain miracles to your kids when you can just have them plant a garden.


Our System:
viewtopic.php?t=8016


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 26th, '11, 09:13 
Offline
Xtreme Contributor
Xtreme Contributor

Joined: Mar 5th, '11, 10:32
Posts: 113
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yea
Location: Texas
amm- 3
nitrites-.5
nitrates-20
ph-7.8
temp-72

The ammonia has gone down but the nitrites have increased as well as the nitrates. My ph has also decreased by almost 1 point from the starting spot which was 8.6. These may be signs of balanceing out.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 26th, '11, 09:30 
Offline
Xtreme Contributor
Xtreme Contributor

Joined: Mar 5th, '11, 10:32
Posts: 113
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yea
Location: Texas
countrydirt wrote:
I saw your post and pondered some responses. First off, I think you need to consider this project for the long haul. I don't know what year you are in school, but AP seems like a good basis for a 2 or 3 year study. Second, I wonder if there is a way to measure the total nitrogen and the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates in both the control and the AP system. That might be an interesting comparison, particularly over time. Third, a measurement of the total biomass of each system might be a great comparison. Just some thoughts.

Good luck. I am an ag teacher so I will follow this with great interest.



Sorry I missed this. I am a junior in highschool and this is for the agriscience fair for FFA. So if I wish i could do it next year and have better results or do it this year with what I have, and provide other testemonies from other growers to back my data. The main idea behind this was just to grow food for other projects, and provide filteration for my pond ( that takes up much of the room in the green house). It gives the pond more of a purpose than just a soaking area. Right now I am only collecting data on the lettuce since it seems to be acclimating well and showing good results.

I am already seeing great results in the greens. My grow bed is being filled up by leafs. I have never had luck with growing lettuce until I got into AP.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 26th, '11, 21:36 
Offline
Legend Member
Legend Member
User avatar

Joined: Jul 20th, '08, 19:03
Posts: 651
Gender: None specified
Are you human?: What time is it?
Location: Australia nsw
Looks good mate :thumbright:

See what the results are tomorrow... rites and rates are looking fine... would be interesting to see what they show over the next weeks worth of tests, and its good to see your Amm coming down. :headbang:

Keep up the good work... by the way - got any pics for us?

_________________
Why try to explain miracles to your kids when you can just have them plant a garden.


Our System:
viewtopic.php?t=8016


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Science fair project
PostPosted: Mar 26th, '11, 23:33 
Offline
Xtreme Contributor
Xtreme Contributor

Joined: Mar 5th, '11, 10:32
Posts: 113
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yea
Location: Texas
I really do need to get pics. I started a thread under members systems, but havent really recived many followers. I will post pics on there soon. I still need to work on my sump tank since my pond is being drained alot. I thought I could do it with out but that didnt seem to work out.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC + 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Portal by phpBB3 Portal © phpBB Türkiye
[ Time : 7.476s | 18 Queries | GZIP : Off ]