All times are UTC + 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: The Journey begins...
PostPosted: May 26th, '12, 15:32 
Offline
Almost divorced
Almost divorced

Joined: Mar 21st, '12, 11:42
Posts: 1358
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yes
Location: Bendigo, Victoria
So... a sanity check please...

Note I have started taking pics and will be posting as I progress. I recently bought a pre-working system that I plan to get running this week - but with the GH arriving there will be a conflict of time.

I will have a greenhouse, 4.3m long, 2.5m wide... I have on site an IBC system, with IBC FT and half IBC GB, along with covers etc. and a couple of clean IBC's. Still to come are a BYAP circular pond about 1000L I plan to use as sump, and some more GB's

I plan to have a ST as above, possibly 1350L of GB and an 1100L IBC FT. I figure once I have things running I will increase the GB's by cutting an IBC in 2 or perhaps using half barrels on stands or shelves.

I'm going to get the basics up and running just to keep the media 'live' and so reduce the cycling needed, then work on the layout in the GH to get an idea of how extensive I can get in the space and start adding pieces to a working system.

My idea is to run things at ambient temps (for a GH) on CHIFT PIST (kind of) - the difference being I am wondering, once I get the base system settled, if I can run fish in the ST at one temp and have a warm FT for (say) barramundi.

If anyone in Victoria has info on GH temps in normal weather (I have a shade system for hot summer times so it is mainly winter warmth I am concerned with) I'd appreciate finding out how they go.

Here are my questions:

1. Can I run fish in a cold ST then warm the water before it reaches the FT then cool it again in the GB's? The GB's are 2 x half IBC's and 2 x blue barrels split lengthwise and joins at bases.

2. If I add a heater for the warm FT, should I put it in a separate container to avoid hot spots in the FT?

3. If I run water from a populated ST into the FT, should I be doing some filtering? I'm wondering if a half barrel GB (approx 100L) would provide a decent amount of cleaning so I don't build up fish wastes in the FT - or is that a matter of ramping up the flow out of the FT? I'd pump from the ST up to a high GB and let it drain back to the FT, then drain from the FT to more GB's (also another cooling step) back to the ST.

Is that making sense? Highest point would be the small GB above the FT, then back to the IBC FT and normal flow from there out to the main GB area, then down to a low profile ST on the ground.

Has anyone used a GH and kept track of temps inside versus outside? Is a cold tank feasible inside a GH?

Thanks for any info you can give...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
    Advertisement
 
PostPosted: May 26th, '12, 20:16 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: May 6th, '11, 12:06
Posts: 12194
Gender: Male
Location: Northern NSW
Ok... Ive read this over and over and am having dificulty picturing the lay out you have in mind.

I will say though... If you are prepared to heat your FT to run Barra all year round then you would have to heat it to a point where your entire water volume (including sump) would be at a required temp. You cant heat your FT then hope it to be cool enough in your sump for trout... not possible.

Other than that Im not sure why you would even want to heat a FT but then have it cool in a sump. If you are prepeared to spend the money on heating the FT...... do that then run perch and barra all year round.

_________________
~2010/2011~
~2012/2013~
~2014~
~Backyard farming~


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: May 26th, '12, 21:35 
Offline
Xtreme Contributor
Xtreme Contributor
User avatar

Joined: Jan 2nd, '12, 08:23
Posts: 239
Location: YANBEBUP, City of Cockburn
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yes
Location: Western Australia, AUSTRALIA
How are you going to heat the water? what will you use?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: May 26th, '12, 22:33 
Offline
Almost divorced
Almost divorced

Joined: Mar 21st, '12, 11:42
Posts: 1358
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yes
Location: Bendigo, Victoria
I am still sorting through ideas I guess. I like the idea of having both cold and warm water fish so I figured you guys are the ones to ask.

Part of the idea of feeding to a warm tank then using the GB's to cool it was to also provide a possibility of more tropical plants at one end of the GH and temperate at the other. The GH comes with a couple of auto-vents that can be set for temp-controlled operation - if I put them all at the end near the doors and have the warm part of the system at the far end I figure I could have a reasonable temp differential between the two ends.

Heating would be using solar panels to a battery bank and probably an inverter to provide 240V feed to a normal aquarium heater. Not sure if the inverter would be needed if aquarium heaters are 12V or 24V. With the battery bank I'd think I could provide a continuous heating cycle through winter and simply a thermostat control to 'top up' in the warmer months.

There's a place in Melb that sells quite well-specced inverters for lots less than the solar companies want - e.g. 2300W 24V DC to 240V AC is about $400 - which makes a fairly high wattage system quite affordable.

But I guess you're right that it doesn't make sense to heat the water then let it cool again only to heat it some more. Two systems might be better. Or maybe it would be just too hard to do under one roof because the GB's would be radiating at least a good part of that heat into the GH air so I'd end up warming the cool tank anyway...

Although if I have 2 systems I could have the 2nd sump outside the GH and insulated from the Sun to keep it as cool as possible...

Note I am not trying to set all this up right now - I'm trying to see what is feasible so as I set things up I leave myself room for adapting and altering without having to take apart the system entirely.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: May 26th, '12, 22:45 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: May 6th, '11, 12:06
Posts: 12194
Gender: Male
Location: Northern NSW
Im all for your enthusiasm journeyman :thumbright:

Heating and cooling come at a cost. Combine them and I would imagine the costs would be massive. The only set up plauseable would be two seperate systems.... but would still come at a cost.

Your in WA, why not do what the rest of us are doing and stock per season. Barra in summer... trout in winter. :dontknow:

Many have experimented with cooling and many have experimented with heating. Only one comes to mind that is at low cost and works well and thats Mattyry's Chilli tank.

viewtopic.php?f=18&t=9917&hilit=chilly+tank

_________________
~2010/2011~
~2012/2013~
~2014~
~Backyard farming~


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: May 26th, '12, 22:53 
Offline
A posting God
A posting God
User avatar

Joined: Dec 10th, '11, 15:03
Posts: 2089
Gender: Male
Are you human?: What is human?
Location: Perth Hills
As you mentioned also, in such a small area you would be struggling to get the temperature differential.

Also you would need a lot of aquarium heaters. You may well find that by not heating and running it in a green house you actually get really good grow out with trout. The warmer the water the faster their metabolism and all that.

_________________
Aquarium System
IBC System
Blog


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: May 27th, '12, 10:30 
Offline
Almost divorced
Almost divorced

Joined: Mar 21st, '12, 11:42
Posts: 1358
Gender: Male
Are you human?: yes
Location: Bendigo, Victoria
Hey Charlie... I'm in Victoria rather than WA so we don't quite have the warmth you guys get - unless things have changed since the 70's when I lived over there. :D

I think I might have the AP virus I saw mentioned elsewhere on here - I woke in the middle of the night thinking about how I could hang plastic strips (like they use in doorways to keep the flies out) across the GH to help the temp control...

Are there shots I can get? :lol:

@rsevs3 - I thought trout were cold water fish? If it gets warm don't they stop eating and lose condition?

So... so far it seems that the idea of trying both cold and warm ecospheres isn't really a goer? If I could achieve it, it would only be at the cost of extensive power usage? That's a bugger... Maybe something to be tried on small scale once I have a functioning and mature system running...

What I might make sure of though is that I place my FT at the far end from my sump - then if I do want to try stuff like this, I can just add something, not dismantle, shovel, remantle and fill just to try something which may not work.

I'm in Bendigo, so wth our weather patterns, the GH should mean I can extend either cold OR warm seasons, so if I go barra I could get good growth for perhaps 8 months even if I can't do year round. we get a lot of sun here so even in winter I should have minor troubles keeping the water above 22ºC.

I'm not sure I wouldn't have a lot of power to play with - I'm thinking a couple of 190W panels, a couple of deep cycle batteries, and an inverter to transform to 240V 50Hz power. Later additions would be failover (I have several pumps, 2 x approx 2000L and an 8500L one) & several air pumps) so I can actually be reasonably confident of being able to take a day or so away from the system and perhaps a UPS controller to allow connection to mains as well as further back up.

I'm thinking total power consumption would be somewhere around 200W. If the drain isn't enough to compensate for the solar input I'd add in grow-lux fluoros or bulbs to increase the plant growth.

All just ideas at the moment - I started all this as I retired but then got an offer too good to refuse so I am working (part time) again so my research time took a dive. :(

Still, what's life without a challenge. :D


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 

All times are UTC + 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 30 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Portal by phpBB3 Portal © phpBB Türkiye
[ Time : 0.121s | 18 Queries | GZIP : Off ]