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PostPosted: Mar 17th, '09, 21:47 
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Ok, Just talked to Joedy Gray at Texas parks and wild life and here is what I have learned as this applies to personal tilapia rearing. I thought I would post this info just FYI, if anyone cares.

Joedy Gray, Texas Parks & Wild Life wrote:
If you use Tilapia mossambica you will not need a permit. If you use either Tilapia aurea or T. nilotica you will have to obtain an exotic species permit from us, an aquaculture license from the Texas Dept. of Agiculture, and a wastewater exemption from the Texas Commission on Environmental Quality.


Now clearly, he does not grasp the idea of AP and there being no waste water discharge. They seem quite willing to be agreeable. I have also inquired about the cost and process for permitting.

Now my question do the commercial breads fit the aurea or T. nilotica descriptions? What other breads are there.

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PostPosted: Mar 17th, '09, 22:05 
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:) and quoted from my soon to be public aquaponic document:

Check similar regulations in your own area. United States, Texas aquaculture permit may be $250 USD and $350.00 USD for an Exotic Permit for most Tilapia although Mozambique Tilapia is the only species of Tilapia that is legal to stock in private impoundments in Texas without a permit.

In Texas it is legal to use caught fish from public waters with regular fishing permit regulations. Check the Texas Aquaculture Association for an approved fish list and supplies list if you plan to sell fish. There are usually more regulations to abide by if you intend to sell wildlife.

Texas Parks and Wildlife Recreational Fishing Regulations http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/publications/annual/fish/

Texas Aquaculture Association
http://www.texasaquaculture.org/id236.htm


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PostPosted: Mar 17th, '09, 22:37 
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I know here in FL, Tilapia aurea are simply allowed in most states because they have already naturalized here and therefore more escapes wouldn't make much difference while other kinds of Tilapia are not allowed without the permits.

If that is the case there, then I suspect any hybrids would have to count as exotic and need the permits.

As to the waste water situation, either no commercial AP set up has pushed for a waiver for that requirement or they were not granted such a waiver. Remember that if a set up has to do any big water changes, they would need a way to dispose of the changed water. Just dumping it on a garden isn't really an option for a large scale commercial facility. They want to make sure whatever is set up on a commercial scale can actually handle what they are doing without creating any huge problems. Florida has it's naturalized population of Tilapia aurea because some Aquaculture facilities in the past flooded and the fish escaped. They probably just want to avoid that sort of thing as well as wanting to avoid polluting water ways with runoff from unregulated fish farms.

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PostPosted: Mar 17th, '09, 22:40 
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Seriously, this cant be healthy.
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:wink: makes sense hey?

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PostPosted: Mar 17th, '09, 22:44 
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Yep, makes sense. So little of the permitting has anything to do with individuals. One official said "just do it and we will not care"; Ill withhold names, lol.

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PostPosted: Mar 17th, '09, 22:49 
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They may also be protective of having fish released into the environment that may have been fed chemicals or genetically altered. :shock:


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PostPosted: Mar 18th, '09, 05:22 
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Thorn,
Were the permits a onetime thing or annual cost?

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PostPosted: Mar 18th, '09, 05:37 
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I didn't read all of them but I would tend to think they would follow other permits being a yearly cost to cover the expense of maintaining registered permits and enforcing laws. A call to Tx Parks and Wildlife could get you quick answers.


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PostPosted: Mar 18th, '09, 22:21 
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To avoid permitting food fish I am working with gourami. These are a tropical fish that are not included in Arizona fiah and game permit requirments. They reportedly require 72 to 82 deg F. In my green house water I now have 65 deg. and have just released 3 blue gourami as trial. i wont add any more heat than required. Do a google of gourami and take a close look. The kissing gourami get to 12 inches in a year. The are omnivours and will eat algae. They breed readily under a floating veggie. I have contacted my local petco and they sell at $4.49 each with perhaps 10% off in quantity. That is cheaper for me than shipping in catfish or talaipia. Gourami are cultured for food in Asia.
I will let you know if these survive in my 65 deg water. If So will add the kissing varity that grow larger. I have yet to finish my solar heating arrangment.


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PostPosted: Mar 18th, '09, 22:42 
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I didn't know people ate those.


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PostPosted: Mar 19th, '09, 01:51 
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My max price is about .28 cents each, no way I can buy at a pet store.

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PostPosted: Mar 19th, '09, 09:31 
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My shipping cost for 20, 4 inch catfish was $115 plus $2.50 per fish and several were DOA. I still have four in my pond but it is doubtful they will breed there. I wont drive five hours to get them and haul them home for another five hours. It is just as far or as expesive to ship and purchase talapia and would need a permit to do so. The outfit that sold me the catfish forgot to ask for a permit. $4.49 for an edible fish that will breed and wont require permits is a bargin for me. My real bother is to set up to heat the water but that would apply to talapia also.


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PostPosted: Mar 19th, '09, 20:32 
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I am adding 1000 blue gill to my system this year. I am going to see how they work out. The cost is only going to be $250. Thats about the same price as tilapia. I decided that I will grow twice as many of these fish. While they will not reach a pound by seasons end. I figure if I have twice as many then I should have a similar amount of meat.

I will get my tilapia breading setup going this year so that next year I can provide my own stock. However, its so late already and commercial tilapia are not available for another month that I have decided to not wait.

BTW 1000 tilapia delivered by bus or air port of your choice only cost $280. I know that more than most people can handle, but if a few people shared an order it would be a bargain.

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PostPosted: Mar 19th, '09, 21:48 
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28 cents each sounds a bargain...
A split would help 8)
$140 = 500fish :flower:

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PostPosted: Mar 19th, '09, 23:30 
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DanDMan wrote:
Ok, Just talked to Joedy Gray at Texas parks and wild life and here is what I have learned as this applies to personal tilapia rearing. I thought I would post this info just FYI, if anyone cares.

Joedy Gray, Texas Parks & Wild Life wrote:
If you use Tilapia mossambica you will not need a permit. If you use either Tilapia aurea or T. nilotica you will have to obtain an exotic species permit from us, an aquaculture license from the Texas Dept. of Agiculture, and a wastewater exemption from the Texas Commission on Environmental Quality.


Now clearly, he does not grasp the idea of AP and there being no waste water discharge. They seem quite willing to be agreeable. I have also inquired about the cost and process for permitting.

Now my question do the commercial breads fit the aurea or T. nilotica descriptions? What other breads are there.



Excuse me for popping up here, I haven't had a chance to introduce myself.

I have been researching this and from what I can read from the online info You will have to have an exotic permit for any Tilapia except Tilapia mossambica. In fact Tilapia mossambica is listed on the Exotic permit as having to be licensed. I suspect they haven't got around to changing the permit form. The cost of the permit is a $250 fee and $25 renewal per year. A aquaculture permit is $120 for 2 years.

As for waste water he says "exemption" that means you don't discharge any waste water. I haven't found out how much that will cost yet.

The way I read the regulations is that you don't have to have a aquaculture permit or a waste water permit unless sell your fish in Texas, but don't rely on that, it's just the way the regulations are worded. I have some local contacts that I am going talk to and see what else I can find out.

You are right that they don't understand Aquaponics, it's just too new around here and the regulations haven't caught up yet. Remember, in Texas most hydroponics setups grow weed. The only hydroponics store in Lubbock is next to a "Smoke Head Shop" and I wouldn't be surprised if they were both owned by the same person.

well I'll get to the intro section and let you know a little about me

Later
Ron


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