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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 12:56 
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definately an overused word, if the speaker was refferring to sustainability as an ideology, I would have to say that is a very pessimistic outlook

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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 16:59 
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Fabian wrote:
definately an overused word, if the speaker was refferring to sustainability as an ideology, I would have to say that is a very pessimistic outlook


Maybe it's the differente ways that sustainability/nature/environement is aproached by a grate many? We love to imagine that at least "I do something about it"
This is a different prospective on sustainable ideolegies
http://rosswolfe.wordpress.com/2011/03/ ... ent/#_ftn7
made me giggle and rethink on a few matters


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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 17:22 
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I make my own flour, from fresh grain, and my own fresh bread every two or three days...making some tomorrow.

Anyways, it got me to thinking that you could make a fish food out of soy/barley, etc. flour, and mix it with worms (when you harvest worms from a worm bin, they are mushy and watery). You could make a great worm/flour paste like when making fresh pasta, then break into small pieces, and lay out flat on trays and dehydrate in the sun. When all is very dry you can make powder or flakes and use that as food for your fish. If you can add some yummy flies and things (which sometimes are easily harvestable from indoor worm bins...) you might be on your way to making a fish mcdonald's in your backyard (or laundry room...or garage).

Just a few thoughts, as I've looked at the label on my fish food and seen what folks have done on the internet to make their own homemade fish food...that's what I have thought about doing, but not had the gumption to do it yet.

Frogs and snails would probably benefit from this food as well.

Sustainability is definitely a good goal for any system...at the moment.

Eventually it will be a need, not just a neat mental exercise.

later,

jeff c

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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 18:26 
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Can't say I agree with much of what that guy has to say..


Comments like this are really just false aren't they?

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In terms of vegan diets, it doesn’t bother me if someone chooses to eat that way, especially if it’s for health reasons. That’s their freedom. But they should not trick themselves into thinking that they’re somehow cutting into the meat companies’ profits. Capitalism is endless production for the sake of production and circulation, not for the sake of consumption. So changing consumptive habits will barely make any difference in production, if any.

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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 18:38 
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I agree with his comments :)


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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 18:45 
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So you think people will produce things without there being any market for the product, just for the sake of producing it?

Guess I can give up worrying about getting customers in the door then, I'll just keep making AP systems, and it won't matter if people stop buying them, somehow I'll still sell them... Even though people aren't buying them... :?

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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 18:49 
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Quote:
The maintenance of such small-scale organic farms would thus seem to be a luxury available only to those who are wealthy enough to afford selling their produce at a loss, or those who find clientele wealthy enough to afford paying much higher prices for locally-grown organic products. It is thus an elitist phenomenon not only in the smug sense of ethical virtue that comes with buying organic or local, but also in a very real, economic sense.


I have to say I disagree with some of what he says aswell..this type of argument ignores external costs imparted on users from intensive farming practices which are also very real economically.

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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 18:56 
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You can't convert everyone eb and there are more meat eaters than vegans which means with a rising population there are going to be more meat eaters plain and simple, there are always going to be people who don't eat meat for whatever reason but to a multi billion dollar industry the vegans dollar value on what vegans don't consume would probably cost as much as the corperate xmas parties


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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 19:00 
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A opinion piece from someone who loves philosophical and political debate.. Quite detached from reality I think...

Quote:
Not only is the historical memory of the locavores fantastic and imaginary, however, but their vision for the future is equally unthinkable and alarming. To generalize the practice of local farming and small shops would mean a regression to a quasi-feudal state of existence, with massive urban depopulation and the death of probably 95% of the Earth’s people.


How does that work, a large percentage of the earth's population lives as substance farmers or "locavores" right now.. :geek:

I think you underestimate the power of the consumer Matty, and how consumption tastes change... I was referring more to the broad sweeping statement of "Capitalism is endless production for the sake of production and circulation, not for the sake of consumption. So changing consumptive habits will barely make any difference in production, if any."

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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 2nd, '11, 19:05 
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agree on that one. People power is strong as for meat production it will keep increasing and meat producers will continue to have increased profits no matter if there is a few vegans kicking around, as for the underlying reference of the topic yes I completely agree, all the rest of that guys bs is bs so far I can't be bothered going to the site I've got a wicked flu and writing all this was hard.. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 4th, '11, 20:48 
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As for meat eating, you should all look into and make your selves familiar with the work of Joel Salatin at Polyface Farm and Alan Savoury, the founder of Holistic Management....

As for sustainability, it is a misunderstood, misused, and overused work....

To be sustainable simple means to be able to go on, to endure...to me it seems so stupid that anything we do should not be 'sustainable'...

A good way to put it that I heard somewhere once, that I know use in all Intro to Permaculture and full PDC courses is as follows: If a married person was asked 'How is your marriage?'...would they reply, 'Well, its sustainable....'

Of course its sustainable, an unsustainable marriage is called divorce! I propose we aim for much more then to simply be sustainable! To be 'sustainable' should simply be a given in every action and decision we make! We should be setting our sites much higher....perhaps 'sustainable abundance' is more favourable....


Floyd.


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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 9th, '11, 04:21 
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floyd wrote:
While ever we are feeding wild caught fish to fish we cant really call what we do "sustainable"...


I don't know about that... humans are part of the ocean ecosystem, and have been for thousands of years. Just because something is wild caught does not mean that it is not sustainable.

If you are still concerned about it though fish like tilapia don't need any sort of fish meal in their diets, there are also trout feeds available (in the US at least) that are as little as 3% fish meal/oil. Dr. Rick Barrows is currently working on eliminating even that.


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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 29th, '11, 10:14 
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earthbound wrote:
Can't say I agree with much of what that guy has to say..


Comments like this are really just false aren't they?

Quote:
In terms of vegan diets, it doesn’t bother me if someone chooses to eat that way, especially if it’s for health reasons. That’s their freedom. But they should not trick themselves into thinking that they’re somehow cutting into the meat companies’ profits. Capitalism is endless production for the sake of production and circulation, not for the sake of consumption. So changing consumptive habits will barely make any difference in production, if any.



Yes comments like this are TOTALLY FALSE and demonstrate a very ignorant view of economics.
I have no problem with a poor understanding of economics but I have a BIG problem with lies.

The statement is totally backwards. Capitalism is profit driven. THEREFORE a company only produces what customers want. If customers don't want it then the company loses money and either goes broke, or changes the product. A perfect self regulating system.

Socialism in fact, can easily lend itself to the misallocation of capital and resources, as there is no feedback to determine success or failure, rather a bunch of fat authoritarian bureaucrats enjoying the fruits of others work.

What we have today is more socialism than capitalism when it comes to the big banks and companies. Politicians are bought and paid for.
The ONLY solutions is much LESS government, not more. Not MORE regulation and more laws and more control.

"The government that rules the best, rules the least"
-someone

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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 29th, '11, 11:46 
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Well put here

Individualism & Capitalism vs. Collectivism & Monopolies
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVdI4Kx8TdY

Just about every individual who truly understands what socialism means, will realise its a bad idea.

The topic may not be aquaponics, but is such a fundamentally important part of our society, it should be discussed on every forum in existence.

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 Post subject: Re: Pellet free
PostPosted: Oct 30th, '11, 04:08 
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Amen!


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