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PostPosted: Jan 18th, '11, 14:16 
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If the Bedini worked, every electronics company in the world would be manufacturing them by their billions and you could pick one up from the supermarket for $2.99

Think about it, the plans are available to anyone with an internet connection...
It produces a much higher voltage on the output side, but delivers less current.

P=VI... nothing new there.

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PostPosted: Jan 18th, '11, 16:16 
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[stuff deleted]

I'm retiring from this thread

It's been hijacked enough :)

sorry aj

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PostPosted: Jan 19th, '11, 00:27 
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OVER UNITY and free energy has long been the quest. many forums discuss it in much better detail than I am able.

I do, however know anyway we can recover wasted energy (heat, wind, light, mechanical) is only going to help. I think if energy was used like that, to squeeze as much out of each volt before releasing that energy and saying we a done with it, progress will be made. even if that progress is nothing more than our personal understanding of the way things work. There will always be ways to improve efficiency in anything.

this is one of my favorites, http://peswiki.com/index.php/Main_Page

any other recommended reading we can share on the topic?


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PostPosted: Feb 4th, '11, 11:00 
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BullwinkleII wrote:
[stuff deleted]

I'm retiring from this thread

It's been hijacked enough :)

sorry aj



OK one last thing :)

I've been hanging out on fieldlines.com (alternative power equivalent to BYAP ) as part of the next "thing" I'm studying and found a link that I thought might be useful in working out power outputs for different setups etc.

http://www.reuk.co.uk/Calculation-of-Hydro-Power.htm

I know nothing about it other than it was recommended by...

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from what I've read, a well respected and very knowledgeable human indeed, so I'm guessing the calculator is accurate.

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 06:13 
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Sorry to drag up an old topic, but I'm new here and this idea has been rattling around in my head for years. I don't personally believe in a free energy solution (not that I claim to be smart or studied enough to know that for sure). I do think solar is the way to go and could be used to run an entire AP setup during daylight hours. The trick is to keep things running at night.
Looking at pico- or mini-hydroelectric setups and accepting a 50-60% efficiency could you not calculate your energy usage to run your entire system per hour (as you would when planning a solar setup for daytime use) and use double that in solar power to pump up to a reservoir during daylight hours. Then use that water pumped up during the day to run your turbine at night. All of this water being seperate from your AP system of course. This would require a couple of large reservoirs of course and would probably work best using a step-up reservoir system so that a series of smaller pumps could be used to break up the distance of each pump's head.
There is a hydroelectric turbine near the NC-SC border called the Bad Creek reservoir that uses off-time excess energy generated from the dam to pump up to another reservoir that is "stored" until a peak-time demand needs it.

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 09:29 
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You could do something like that, but storing the excess in a battery would be far more efficient.

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 09:33 
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I don't know if it's still the same... but many years back during my travels in the Philippenes, Thailand and India...

I saw lots of locals that had "free" power systems... :mrgreen:

Sadly a lot of them often didn't make it back down the pole after connecting them...

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 10:34 
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Yes, batteries are more efficient and parts of them can be recycled but not having the lead and acid around is a nice thought. Sustainable solutions and all.

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 10:58 
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You also need a huge sump to take all the overflow of all that water that's entering your system throughout the night.

If you are going to have that much water, just make one big tank, and pump to your grow beds only at night.

Charge a battery during the day to run a powerhead at night. 12 watts will move 5000 LPH and keep your system oxygenated.

With enough water in the system, and not too many fish, pumping in daylight only is something people already do. I did it for a while to try to keep my water warm , but found I had to drop the amount of feed I was giving the system by quite a lot.

Making a really efficient system to make it financially viable to run on solar would be a good problem to solve.

I might run it through the invention engine and see what comes out.

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 11:01 
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It can be done on solar... but you need at least an 80w panel... just to cover cloudy days... and that's probably just for something like a "courtyard system"...

Basically it doubles the cost of a system...

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 11:29 
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I saw a picture of a BYAP solar setup somewhere. Is that where you got that 80w requirement from or have you done some stuff yourself?

I'd be interested to see the setup, and learn a bit more about how it worked, and pump flows etc.

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 11:54 
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It was the BYAP system... actually, I think it was a 2 x grow bed 1000L tank system...

From memory... Murray ran a similar configuation... but I think he used a 120w panel..

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 12:03 
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DuiNui wrote:
You could do something like that, but storing the excess in a battery would be far more efficient.


The problem with batteries is that they are expensive, and they need to be replaced regularly :(

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 13:00 
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having a tank up hill to keep pumping all night would mean storing 10 fish tanks full of water per night, plus a backup amount of say another 10 fish tanks for overcast days, plus a backup because on the over cast days your not storing backup water. ie if you have an overcast day and use your backup water, you no longer have a backup until you have a few fine days in a row.

so for a 1000 L fish tank, if you want to run it with the stocking densities of a standard BYAP system, you need to shift 1000 L per hour over the 10 hours a day that there isn't enough light .

That's 10,000 litres of water up the hill.

And another 10,000 litres of empty tank to collect it at the bottom of the hill.

20,000L

Plus a at least a couple of days worth of reduced pumping where your output might be only 20% of what you might expect from a full sunny day.

So say 2 days of water to allow for a 3 or 4 days of not much sunlight in a row.

2 days at 24,000 litres per day is 48,000 litres of water at the top of the hill, and another 48,000 litres of empty tank at the bottom.

96,000 + 20,000 for the first night

so 116,000 litres of "battery" water storage to run a 1000 litre fishtank.

at around 15 cents per litre for poly tanks that's $17,400 plus installation

thats a lot of petrochemical plastic, electricity used in manufacture, and a similar real estate footprint of a small suburban home.

But even without the cost of the real estate were still talking way too close to $20,000 extra to support an IBC sized fishtank.

you could buy a few days of battery backup for less than the interest you would pay on adding the $17k to your mortgage for one year and have $500 left over to buy trees.

Lead acid batteries are recycled as standard practice because it's quite profitable to do so.

And you can get 20 years out of good quality deep cycle batteries if you treat them right.

I abuse mine and its still good after around 8 years. I would guess it holds around 75% of what it did when it was new. But I really did abuse it when I ran my little boat solely from it with an electric trolling motor. Many times I ran it to almost flat.

$17,000 vrs $500

the rainwater tanks are good for 40 years and the batteries for say 10 years (to be very conservative).

so you could buy your 40 years of batteries for 1-2 years of the interest you would pay on the cost of the tanks.

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PostPosted: Dec 24th, '11, 13:01 
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and you would need a bigger pump to pump up to the top of the 2 metre high tanks

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