Nate's Vertical, High-Density System

n8

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The strawberries are cranking and I harvested the basil on Friday. Man, that lemon basil went nuts. 5 wks in the system ended up being too much time for it (and too hot) and the basil started going to seed. But I got good yields, so I'm happy.

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TCLynx

Ya need to set up and do some sort of time lapse pictures, or at least a daily picture of your next crop to show them going from seedlings to the tower shrub they seem to become.

n8

that would be super cool. Maybe take a picture every day at the same time?

I'm putting cilantro, spicy globe basil (my control), oregano, and parseley in on next monday. My seedlings are looking kind of scraggly this go-round, not sure how they'll do. esp. oregano with only 5 weeks. . . seems to me it's pretty slow growing. I love cilantro so I'm super pumped about seeing what it does.

TCLynx

My oregano grows as a perennial here.

DexterK

You've mentioned that the bio surface of the media you are using is very good. Are you simply replacing flood and drain GBs with the vertical tubes or are you using some other sort of bio-filtration or at least a solids filter? If you are simply using the verticals for all the bio needs, like in a basic F&D GB, would you have any idea, even a guess, of how many verticals you need? Say using an equation like; X metres (feet?) of channel per Y kgs (lbs) of bio-mass.

I hope that makes sense :dontknow:

mmcelvy

Very cool system, really would like material details. Are the tubes made from vinyl fence post sleeves? Any word on reselling the planting material? How are they being watered, you said constant running, how big a stream of water?

n8

Dexter- I have found that one 5' tower can handle up to 17 or 18 pounds of fish in a mature system before I start seeing excess ammonia/nitrite. I don't recommend this of course. I recommend more like 5 lbs/tower to start, and only once the towers have been cycled. If it's simpler (for variable length towers), each linear foot of media insert can handle 1 lb fish (to start) and once mature should handle around 3 lbs comfortably. I'm running almost 20 lbs/tower right now and that's too much. I'm putting additional towers in this week.

I'm using a settlment tank, but solids do collect in the towers. I'm finding that redworms work well at keeping the media clean, and running irrigation tubing between the media halves in the top so it's not exposed to sunlight seems to eliminate any blockages.

mmcelvy- I won't get into to many specifics because I've sunk a bunch of money into a patent and I'm starting a company manufacturing these, but I will tell you that everything we use is custom made for us by our suppliers at this point. No, I'm not using sleeves, they're too flimsy and often contain UV resistant chem.s that I'm not too comfortable with. The media is a polyester matrix material custom made for me by a large plastics mfg company. I'll have a website up soon selling the stuff along with towers.

I irrigate them constantly from the top of the tower. I've found that three streams spread the water out pretty well, and I use my oversized pump to blast them out once per day. They typically run around 7 gph per tower. But on my other sys. I"m running a bit less. . .more like 3 or 4 gph.

n8

The strawberries seem to be coming out of a rest phase where they were sending out lots of runners and not flowering as much. I've been cutting back runners as often as I can and they're starting to bear really well. The fruit size has increased and the number too. I'm getting about 1/2 pound every other day. Here's a picture of the berries from the other day. I ate a few before I thought of taking a picture.

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The plants are really starting to flower again too. I just have to keep the top plants from getting too heat damaged. My GH has been way to hot for them lately and the top plants are burning (leaves, flowers) and the fruits aren't developing or are mummifying.

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Dave Donley

BNDYBEAR

WOW this could be the most interesting thread I have read since I found this forum.
Not only because the concept may have solved my lack of space for filtration on my prototype system but because it is probably the most productive method for a commercial system I have seen.
I will be following this thread regularly from here on and look forward to your website coming online.

RupertofOZ

BNDYBEAR wrote:

but because it is probably the most productive method for a commercial system I have seen.

That's a very bold statement Bndybear...

The system effectively utilises a vertical footprint... but there are other systems that also do the same...

And it may prove to be limited to specific type of plants....

Given the cost of the media, and plumbing components, and probable limitations of height...

I have doubts that it would match a UVI style raft system... or even an NFT style system in a "commercial" sense.....

TCLynx

I would estimate that it is very comparable to NFT with one very big difference, These vertical modified NFT channels provide the filtration and aeration.

Sure, they are much like the raft and NFT type set ups in the need for regular attention and being most appropriate for short term or fast crops and needing re-planting.

The carry a great benefit for a small commercial grower who runs a stand or market stall though. You can pop some towers down and take them to market for a U-pick sort of thing. This of course would require having extra tower units on hand to re-plant and install while the others are away but it is a pretty cool feature.

There are of course drawbacks to any system but I think these towers will find their way into the line up of useful methods. Especially in situations where greenhouse space is at a premium and hanging towers directly over the tanks is desired.

n8

Dave- yes

very mmmm. i'm having to guard my greenhouse against thieves and robbers now. all of the other folks with greenhouses in my complex keep threatening to steal my strawberries. . . I'm going to have to put in cameras. . .

BNDBEAR- thanks for the vote of confidence. I really like it so far. It let's me maximize my floorspace in a serious way. I'm going to be putting in some more towers this week to make up for my fat fish and all of thier babies. Man, I just can't keep these things from reproducing. . . i guess they're staying entertained.

Rupert- I'll have some numbers soon- I'll be as interested as you to see how they perform in comparison to more traditional commercial techniques, especially when thier ability to do direct, live sales is considered. I'm planning on doing a study with towers in a local organic/whole foods store letting consumers pick thier own produce. I'll let you know how it goes. I guess we'll find out if people are adverse to plants grown in fish poop!

TC-you're absolutely right. if anything happens with these towers, i would love for it to be someone making money at an aquaponic farm stand-most of the things i've grown are so expensive at the supermarket. (fresh basil here is almost $1/oz! and it's really sad basil)

RupertofOZ

Absolutely... you're right as to the benefit of the incorporated filtration TCL... and don't get me wrong N8... I think the towers are pretty neat and a good idea, especially with the filtration aspect, and the ability to transport the whole thing to market...

Just trying to point out though that they may not scale, cost wise... in relation to infrastructure... to a "commercial" operation....

But I'm viewing "commercial" in terms of a hydro operation perspetive.... and that means 40,000 holes...

And that really is a minimum when you sit down and do the sums....

Small/hobby scale direct to farmers markets.... sure there's probably a few dollars there... as a supplementary income stream....

But there are other vertical systems around... and none of them has proven to be "commercially viable" yet...

Like the "Verti-grow" system....

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Or the "stackapots"...

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Or even the "Fruitwise" system (which I've used here in OZ)...

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RupertofOZ

Having said the above.... Nate's towers are probably... or may be... :wink:

... a lot less expensive to purchase, and the media cheaper.... in relation to the examples above...

And they most certainly do provide the additional benefit of filtration....

The costings/profitability in the end might come down to the supporting infrastructure costs... like the plumbing/pumping....

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